Neudohum

neil4768 · Posted: Thu Jul 01, 2010 7:44 pm Post subject:

Berthold

Did not noticed any kind of infection on it.

I have already done so, I have

Orchis mascula
Ophrys sphegodes

Already potted up in the new Sylvamix and what they where previously in.
And I have some Dactylorhiza purpurella and fuschii that I will do later on once they have died back for the winter.

The rest of my Winter green orchids I have moved in to the Sylvamix.

goofy · Settling in Joined: 23 Jan 2007 Posts: 61

sorry Tassos, I did not ask your permission Wink

but the picture with your
Orchis italica tuber was so impressive to me,
that I MUST post it 'immediately' here in the forum.

It does not need any explanation, except,
that it was grown in "pure magical" Neudohum Very Happy

cheers

SzPeter_hu · Posted: Wed Jul 21, 2010 9:28 pm Post subject:

nice tuber. you could use it for food if you run out of potatoes. Twisted Evil

The photo makes me want to get a bag of that neudohum...

berthold · Posted: Wed Jul 21, 2010 10:21 pm Post subject:

tkodka · Posted: Thu Jul 22, 2010 5:24 pm Post subject:

Hello Dieter

Look another two very big tubers! Thank's Neudohum...
And something else. I planted 11 tubers of Serapia lingua and now I have 79 !!!Incredible..

Tassos

goofy · Settling in Joined: 23 Jan 2007 Posts: 61

Tassos, you are the GREATEST Smile

Congrats !!

And don't tell the guys, where you live Wink

Rogier · Well established Joined: 23 Jan 2007 Posts: 245

Holy Cow!! This is amazing (bordering the ridiculous)

The fact that you got so many S. lingua tubers and that tubers become so big is very good news. Stuff like this is much needed as it might be a good way to artificially produce tubers for the Salep industry one day.

Greetings

Rogier

tkodka · Posted: Fri Jul 23, 2010 7:52 pm Post subject:

Propably thereis a misanterstanding here.The last tubers aren't Serapia lingua. They are Barlia robertiana. But anyway the fact is that 11 tubers of Serapia lingua produce 79 new.This is a fact.

SzPeter_hu · Posted: Sat Jul 24, 2010 7:46 am Post subject:

goofy · Settling in Joined: 23 Jan 2007 Posts: 61

hey,
Neudohum Pflanzerde is ok:
http://www.schneckenprofi.de/neudohum-pflanzerde.html?id=6iXkavDj&mv_arg=cc%3d1801000000000&mv_pc=1566

unfortunately Neudorff dont sell to other countries yet.

so you must visit Germany during your next vacations Wink

cheers

SzPeter_hu · Posted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 6:28 pm Post subject:

Maybe there is another way. Seramis is also only available in Germany but some sellers on e-bay are willing to export it. It's much cheeper than the long travel.

berthold · Posted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 9:49 pm Post subject:

SzPeter_hu · Posted: Mon Jul 26, 2010 7:19 am Post subject:

My experience shows that Seramis is the very best. Other substrates can't hold that much water, so I prefer to use the original.

But is this Neudohum Pflanzerde so special? It sounds like normal black mould used for everyday gardening. Can this also be substituted?

neil4768 · Posted: Mon Jul 26, 2010 9:57 pm Post subject:

Done a bit of trawling the net about lignite (Braunkohle) which is a component of Neudohum Pflanzerde.

I have found this patent regarding a the use of lignite in a growing medium.

Is the lignite the magically ingredient?

goofy · Settling in Joined: 23 Jan 2007 Posts: 61

hello Neil,
you dont need "Braunkohle", even if you can buy it here in Germany in 50 Kg bags, nobody needs it any more to fire his oven,

maybe its easier to use "rockwool", -mentioned in that "Patent"- Wink

which is used for insulation purposes in houses Smile

cheers

neil4768 · Posted: Tue Jul 27, 2010 12:42 pm Post subject:

The bit that intrigued me was this bit.

Is this allowing the orchids to get the maximum amount of nutrients thus allowing it too survive better?

andrew · Posted: Wed Jul 28, 2010 5:38 am Post subject:

Is the cation exchange capacity of brown coal much higher than that of peat or coir?

goofy · Settling in Joined: 23 Jan 2007 Posts: 61

hey,
I am not a chemist, but I think,
there is a difference between
Lignite and Lignine. Confused

they are talking here about Lignite.............

I think, that the Lignite is not in coir or peat or any other wood,
thats Lignine.
Lignine is a main part of any "wooden material"

But am not informed,
whether some manufacturer adds "brown coal" to his mixtures,
and whether its in Neudohum .......... Question

cheers

andrew · Posted: Wed Jul 28, 2010 11:16 am Post subject:

I wasn't really talking about the lignin content of coir, peat or lignite (lignite is brown coal). The quote that Neil provided stated that one of the benefits of using lignite as a plant medium is that it has a high CEC. Peat and coir also have high CEC's so I was wondering whether lignite has a markedly higher CEC than peat or coir to make it's ability to hold nutrients any better than peat or coir. If lignite has a higher CEC, maybe Neil's right that it's the lignite component that is the key. If it doesn't, why not just use a peat or coir in your mix instead? In saying that, I presume that the commonly available peat or coir based potting mixes don't give the same results as Neudohum, otherwise you wouldn't all be raving about Neudohum.

Are people going off Berthold's idea that the bio-inoculant in Neudohum is the primary benefit?

goofy · Settling in Joined: 23 Jan 2007 Posts: 61

hey,
who says, that the Neudohum contains "lignite/ brown coal"
as a "secret" of its success?

the list of "ingredients" does not show this.
it only states expressively that Neudohum
does NOT have peat in the formula.

and the company does NOT state,
that there are any "special" fungus in the soil..........
(except those from "normal/natural" rotting composts)

so NOBODY KNOWS

Question

cheers

neil4768 · Posted: Wed Jul 28, 2010 3:59 pm Post subject:

Dieter

This is what Neudorff say about the mixture

Substrate manufactured by using bark , wood and coconut fiber , lignite and mineral NPK fertilizer and iron

and further down its says

with "bodenbelebenden" micro organisms, but not sure what "bodenbelebenden" translates as from German

http://www.neudorff.de/produkte/produkt-katalog/katalog/neudohum-pflanzerde.html

SzPeter_hu · Posted: Wed Jul 28, 2010 7:08 pm Post subject:

Did anyone compare Neudohum with any other products or with leaf-litter and top-soil mixture collected in a forest? Does it really have any advantages? Even though it seems excellent according to your trials, maybe other substrates would be just as good as this if anyone gave them a chance. Or is Neudohum really superior above all else?

tkodka · Posted: Wed Jul 28, 2010 8:03 pm Post subject:

Hello again
I used in the past all the kind of soils.I used peat, blond or black , I used total non-organic soil like pure perlite or perlite mixed with light stones or vermiculate ,I used soil from my garden etc etc.All these years this year was the best I had. I used pure Neudohum .I think it is not only the fungi that contains but is the way it holds the water.Not too much , not too little .This is my opinion.This year I will try to increase the Ph of that soil in the pots with Ophrys because I think Ophrys need a little alcalic PH and Neudohum's PH is a little acid.

neil4768 · Posted: Wed Jul 28, 2010 8:50 pm Post subject:

berthold · Posted: Wed Jul 28, 2010 9:17 pm Post subject:

tkodka · Posted: Thu Jul 29, 2010 7:09 am Post subject:

Thanks Betrhold I will think about it.
Just another photo for comparisons.
Tubers of Spiranthes spiralis.Last September the tubers had the same size and I plant them the one in pure Neudo and the other to a semi anorganic usual soil.
Look the result.The pencil is of for calculate the size.

Tassos

goofy · Settling in Joined: 23 Jan 2007 Posts: 61

neil4768 · Posted: Thu Jul 29, 2010 9:08 am Post subject:

Thanks

tkodka · Posted: Thu Jul 29, 2010 12:01 pm Post subject:

I just want to say something more

I think is a mistake to say that Neudohum is magic etc etc. It is not only the soil the factor for sucssesfull germination.There are many other factors like air humidity , sunlight,rain, etc etc and maybe a combination of all these are the cause of these big tubers.Of course soil is the most important and that' why this post is too long..

Tassos

berthold · Posted: Thu Jul 29, 2010 12:47 pm Post subject:

tkodka · Posted: Thu Jul 29, 2010 1:31 pm Post subject:

I am very sorry I wrote a wrong word. I would like to write "successful cultivation" not "successful germination".Forgive my english.

berthold · Posted: Thu Jul 29, 2010 2:02 pm Post subject:

goofy · Settling in Joined: 23 Jan 2007 Posts: 61

fred · Posted: Fri Jul 30, 2010 2:35 pm Post subject:

goofy · Settling in Joined: 23 Jan 2007 Posts: 61

SzPeter_hu · Posted: Fri Jul 30, 2010 8:30 pm Post subject:

I just found this:

http://www.gartenversand-omega.de/weitere-produkte/erden-substrate/neudorff-neudohum-orchideenerde.html

a kind of neudohum for "all orchids" as the label sais, but I have a feeling that this "all" does not include terrestrials Mad

goofy · Settling in Joined: 23 Jan 2007 Posts: 61

sebastoss · Joined: 23 Jan 2007 Posts: 48

Hello guys,

Happy about the confirmation of Neudohum excellent results. But the mystery persists, and the reason why the product is so efficient have to be determined. The Glomus hypothesis really make sense and interest me to the point that I will make a Neudohum like mix this fall.

I ordered 1 kg of a French product called Solrize that is a dormant Glomus strain specifically developed for substrate protection and Mycorhizal activity.

I planed to use a peat based mix from Plagron that is called Royalty-Mix, Seramis and Solrize. The Royalty-Mix is organic rich, with plenty of fibers and Worm compost, a High grade peat based mix if you prefer.

My problem is about ph that is in the range [5,8 - 6,2], a bit too low for Ophrys. I need to rise the ph with chalk or crushed oyster shell.

All your advises are welcome to help me create the best mix possible.

Thanks in advance,
Seb